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+--- Thread: Questions about proposed changes (/showthread.php?tid=16194)
Questions about proposed changes - Nori - 07-23-2011
Orion Wrote:Then why are you banging on about a system that will be replaced and has been mentioned that it will be replaced repeatedly? If you're not up to date with what's happening, you're just making useless posts.
Like I said, I was defending my stance from a few pages back. Your the one making useless posts if you won't even read my last one. I haven't had time to read it as of yet, I'm just stating I don't like the Zeni system for PP.
Edit: Also, as Kaden has said, it's not concrete as of yet.
Questions about proposed changes - Orion - 07-23-2011
The point is that Jobs/Quests are going, and you're still arguing like we're going to keep it. If you'd actually read anything, you'd realise that everything you've said so far is meaningless to the thread. And you're not just stating you don't like it, you're arguing that it shouldn't stay because of this, this and this, but it's going. Like Kaden said, it's really aggravating to see someone arguing a point that isn't even a point anymore. Staff get really tired of repeating themselves and arguing in circles.
Questions about proposed changes - Ashe - 07-23-2011
Nori Wrote:And it would. =P
"It would" as in you using your power up in a spar with Vad as part of a personal story would use your PP up even though its a personal story where you have already decided the outcome in advance with no staff involvement?
Questions about proposed changes - Sigfried Hunin - 07-23-2011
The only thing I will say about the use of PP and recharging it with zenni is that nobody fuckin uses it cause ya can't get it back easily lol
It's hard enough to get enough zenni to buy shit you really want anyways, and thenyou're just heavily imposed by tryin to recharge your shit with zenni. I know zenni is going/changing, so I don't know how much of an influence that will remain.
Questions about proposed changes - Nori - 07-23-2011
Orion Wrote:The point is that Jobs/Quests are going, and you're still arguing like we're going to keep it. If you'd actually read anything, you'd realise that everything you've said so far is meaningless to the thread. And you're not just stating you don't like it, you're arguing that it shouldn't stay because of this, this and this, but it's going. Like Kaden said, it's really aggravating to see someone arguing a point that isn't even a point anymore. Staff get really tired of repeating themselves and arguing in circles.
Then why does he continue to argue against me? I wanted it gone, and as you say, it's going. If your mature enough to be on staff then you should be mature enough to drop the argument. I'm only commenting on posts against me, nothing more. My whole "jobs/quest" thing started before it was going to be dropped. I've been done with it for awhile, it's just people keep bringing up things against my viewpoint. As for it being "aggravating" then just fucking drop it. I haven't said anything different from my original stance pages back because I don't know, don't care, whatever, about what is going on. I said my opinion on Zeni and he disagrees, arguing about it. Then later I get criticized for arguing about something that is getting changed already, the fuck?
I was done a long time ago, it's just people keep bringing it back up. By people, that be of course Kaden'.
To Ashe. Who said I've decided the outcome in advance? For me it directly effects my personal story, but for him it's whatever. It's a pvp fight, just like any that occurs in a saga.
Questions about proposed changes - John Doe - 07-24-2011
Kaden Wrote:Given that, what wasn't been added that you would like to see?
I'd like for staff to gain the powers to control people's minds and alter their behavior so they RP more instead of being lazy, distracted, or disinterested. Myself included.
In all seriousness, let's try to get this thread on track. I thought the Job system was a fine system. But like CA, I don't care if it gets deleted in favor of autozeni gain.
I'd like to see more items added. Since Items are currently split from XP and Techs, they need to have some incentive to being "harder" to get than XP is. I know that big things with Zeni are that they refill PP, Alliances, and transportation to planets, but they could probably do more.
Somebody mentioned this (I believe it was Trafford), but a separate forum for bullshit posts (under 300 words being allowed) involving our characters that isn't canon would be awesome. Rapid fire posting would be cool in that it's a hell of a lot easier than writing 1000+ words posts while still keeping you invested in your character/other characters. In my mind, it comes out to be something like DBZ Chibi (oh gawd) where the characters are still the same, but they just do different things than their "real" characters do. Like Doe, for example, was after drugs, alcohol, sex and violence in the "real" Chubbs universe. In Chibi land, he'd be a panty snatcher or something stupid like that. idk.
Making things look shiny and pretty would be nice. You could have a beautiful golden egg decorated in jewels and the like, but if it's covered in mud (or shit, but I don't think Chubbs looks that bad), then you may turn away those that would have been interested if they gave it a shot.
Outside of the actual game of Chubbs RPG, maybe add something like community game nights? I know a lot of us already play LoL like all the time (more than we write ololol) but it would be cool if we kinda scheduled it so newer members could get to know the other members better, staff included (LoL and TF2 are great games for this because they're free and easy to play with friends).
Maybe it was just me, but when I first joined Chubbs, I thought staff were like the "gods" of Chubbs, and it made me scarred to try RPing with them (to follow that statement up, I ALSO thought that I had to roleplay as "Metal" Cooler after the whole Metal Bon Para thing, you guys remember). With a mentor system that I heard somebody mention, and this community thing, newer members might feel "more at home" so to say.
All this coming from a guy who made John Doe just to dick around whenever a Saga reared its head.
Questions about proposed changes - Orion - 07-24-2011
Nori Wrote:Then why does he continue to argue against me?
Because you were wrong.
I'm also a fan of the mentor system. Like Doe said, there's that certain respect that a newcomer holds for the veterans here when they read their writing and helping them along with that and showing an interest in them would definitely be a good thing. I'm just concerned that it would end up the same way the community grading did; no one could be arsed to do it.
Personally, I haven't been roleplaying mostly due to a lack of desire. I really am not that concerned about the system myself, however I'll support what the majority wants. Also wedding planning > my free time.
Questions about proposed changes - Nori - 07-24-2011
Orion Wrote:Because you were wrong.
I'm also a fan of the mentor system. Like Doe said, there's that certain respect that a newcomer holds for the veterans here when they read their writing and helping them along with that and showing an interest in them would definitely be a good thing. I'm just concerned that it would end up the same way the community grading did; no one could be arsed to do it.
Personally, I haven't been roleplaying mostly due to a lack of desire. I really am not that concerned about the system myself, however I'll support what the majority wants. Also wedding planning > my free time.
That's a opinion. I don't think the zeni system was needed, and I'm not the only one who likes how it translates to PP usage. How does that make me wrong?
Also, if I was so "wrong" why would their be talk of revamping the system?
Questions about proposed changes - Victoria - 07-24-2011
There's always talk of revamping the system. There's been talk about revamping the zeni situation for months, and months. We had some hang ups.
Questions about proposed changes - Ashe - 07-24-2011
Quote:To Ashe. Who said I've decided the outcome in advance? For me it directly effects my personal story, but for him it's whatever. It's a pvp fight, just like any that occurs in a saga.
ok, I'm talking about a spar, you are talking about a fight. Those are supposed to have limitations and risks. if I understand you correctly, you want to"compare your true fighting strength" against someone, therefore not wanting to decide the outcome yourself, but you want the system tweaked so that you will always be at your fullest strength when doing so to get the best advantage in judging? maybe I'm misinterpreting you but it sounds very"have my cake and eat it too." It actually dodges most of the point, in that you should not always just be strolling sound in your highway tier, because then there is no reason not to feel that you have to first buy all power ups, which may not fit your actual characters story, just to ever do anything. If you want to stay in top performance, you have to work for that. That said, we are hoping for a more balanced tweak to allow us to do this without feeling required to stop for a few quests every break.
Questions about proposed changes - Shou - 07-24-2011
Sorry if any of my question(s) and or suggestion(s) appear ignorant or have already been covered, but 11 pages is a bit to dig through and I haven't really been following this as closely as I probably should have. Either who couple questions, general musings, or just brainstorming coming your way. The objective is Activity Surge. has talk of defining a concrete battle system been in the works?
I think if we had a definitive battle system as the base of the RPG which was an easy to follow, user-friendly system based on character stats, techniques and traits--but just complex enough that customization was readily available to the user (I actually have a system in mind, but it's from another PbP RPG; I'm not gonna just go ahead and post the link without permission or encourage ripping their system from their site, but it's what initially attracted me to the site and is definitive enough to warrant inspiration). I think the fact that the competitive edge of the rpg has been defined by strictly opinion-based grading for the latest Chubbs generations (this is coming off trends I've noticed when I was active post-Prophecy's Child) can tend to (not always) discourage people from matching wits and building relationships and rivalries. A big thing that drew me here initially was the rivalries, but you don't really see much of that anymore.
Chubbs used to be (as far as PvP goes) a massive force of super powers against another massive force of superpowers. This was cool, but it sort of overpowered the characters who were active (but Chubbs ran on bigger numbers back then). People can easily see this as elitism when an author knows their character well enough to write through multiple posts, threads, and situations. Now it seems as if the sacrifice was made (and it was a major sacrifice, I don't take that away from anyone who had a niche for their character as well as a shit load of Intelligence points for their writing and fighting style) to under-power and balance the characters. That's cool too. But ultimately isn't what's going to define an activity surge.
Motivation and the want-to-do is another factor.
I never though there was a problem with the way the job/quest system works now because it reflects the layman's society today. Don't work, don't get paid. Plus the CC item list is only so long and automating the zeni system is going to have the entire CC shop in someone's pocket after time on site. I also know that this isn't going to change the direction of disposing that system, so I only suggest that you authorize custom items be created through a simple template format. Of course I'm thinking battle items and weaponry to integrate into a battle-based system, but that's just a suggestion.
I bring up the encouragement of battle because of the PP system (which, although it serves a good purpose and has humbling intentions, doesn't really serve a purpose fitting into the trend of players not interacting PvP). I believe that if we push for the trend to promote IC battle-based interactions we can definitely improve the atmosphere of this community as a DBZ-based rpg. That's why we're here, right? Because of an anime series where they leveled planets while they engaged in combat.
I think people should also have the option to Quest for items.
There should probably be a mandatory mentoring system disguised as a Chubbs 'guild' where new members are mandatory and vet's and people looking for incentive are cycled in and out. Sort of like Halo's basic training playlist, except with experienced members motivating newer players through writing. It should also have a generic purpose, but centralized to the Chubbs universe (like Capsule Corp. since it's pivotal in CDBZ universe) so that it's newer member's can easily jump in. Membership should be voluntary past two or three posts, but new guys should be encouraged to work with a 'pen pal' to finish a common goal (which wouldn't go unrewarded for all parties involved).
Stats should be integrated into battle (I saw something about PL v. CA with both existing at the same time and I'm going to read more into it so don't answer this if you don't critique or bash this portion if you don't feel the need). But everything would have to be clearly defined if there was a firm battle-founded system.
Just some thoughts.
Questions about proposed changes - Blue - 07-24-2011
I remember there was a time when the idea of having NPC trainers to teach people stuff was being tossed around. I think that might be an appropriate way to allow characters to learn an ability, or maybe a custom tech along the lines of the King Kai Quests. What ever happened to this anyway?
Questions about proposed changes - Jonathan Meer - 07-24-2011
All of the following is written by a Mod and not an Admin. Just a heads up. Grain of salt.
There are two types of suggestions regarding system change.
First, there is the suggestion that solves an actual problem; it usually begins with the clear delineation/analysis of the problem itself, and is followed by the suggestion which is meant to fix that problem. These suggestions are hugely helpful and welcomed. Discussions that result from this type of suggestion are generally quite productive.
Second, there is the suggestion that is not structured in terms of a problem; it usually involves a fundamental reconstitution of what the current Chubbs system is, and usually introduces a shit-ton of its own problems. The central characteristic of this type of suggestion is that it is something different. These suggestions are generally not as helpful (though all suggestions are, of course, welcomed), and the resulting discussions are generally not at all productive.
Historically, calls for a system-change have been in response to a perceived stagnation of the site, particularly with respect to the impulse to roleplay. Actual system-change has been extremely ineffective in mitigating stagnation; it is at best temporary. There's a lot of hope and yearning for some ideal system that is extremely rewarding and intuitive and simple and nonexistent.
What we need is an influx of members. Fortunately, that's exactly what we're getting in the last few weeks (and by all accounts, will only continue to get).
Which is to say, enjoy the discussion, it happens rather often here at Chubbs, and a lot of bluster will happen, and a lot of creative energies will be spent, and likely not much will come from it. Progress is made from the first type of suggestion. Identify what you see as a problem, and structure your suggestion as a solution to that problem.
Questions about proposed changes - Victoria - 07-25-2011
I fully agree with what Meer posted.
These happen a lot. We need new members, more than anything else.
Questions about proposed changes - Super Buu - 07-25-2011
I largely agree with what Meer posted. S'why, when I post suggestions, I try to make a clear line between stuff that I think is "needed" and stuff that would be cool. The second, I tend to save for random Q/S threads.
Questions about proposed changes - Super Buu - 08-18-2011
I hate to be a pest, but is anything still being discussed? I know it's not been that long, but I'd hate for it to get quietly dropped again <_<
Questions about proposed changes - Celena - 08-18-2011
I was going to bump this thread but you beat me to it.
Questions about proposed changes - Sigfried Hunin - 08-18-2011
I think jobs and quests are cooool, but the idea of zenni i think is a lil.... wonky. I mean, thats already been discussed
Me and vad and piper had a long ass discussion about how PL~CA are both pretty much completelyy arbitrary numbers used mainly for comparison to other fight millioner's power and that made me feel a lot better. Having power levels in like, several millions is equally as dumb as having nu.bers that correlate to nothing at all. The important parts is still the RP. With that in mind though, i think implimenting a different power system wouldn,t chhurt things, and maybe somehow make people happier i guess?
Questions about proposed changes - Vad - 08-19-2011
We are actively discussing certain things about the RPG so the subject has not dropped completely.
Questions about proposed changes - Super Buu - 08-19-2011
I was discussing this with Belle yesterday, and I thought I'd make it 100% clear here because, with the massive overhauls, I feel like this pretty simple message often gets swallowed up in a flood of unnecessary extra shit. In fact, I'm just going to pretty much copy and paste my words:
I could give a shit about the vast majority of changes and improvements. Well, no. I care about them, but they're not going to STOP ME PLAYING.
On the other hand, being a 100th of someone else's power is a big deal. To me, personally. Additionally, saying when someone joins "write for 2 years to catch up" is a big deal to me, personally. Some will disagree, but I think a lot of people are in the same camp. Not even Everquest is that bad. In all other multiplayer RPGs, there's a level cap, which you will eventually reach. There is a curve, which will allow you to get to a similar level to your friends if not the EXACT same level. I'm not saying we have to copy those exact systems. I'm saying they found ways to address massive imbalance without removing the progression that made the games fun.
Removing that problem is all I think is really necessary. It's seriously not THAT hard to create a system which doesn't irrevocably trivialise newbies and 'casual writers' (lol) within a few months of its implementation, which ALL of our systems have done (besides removing CA outright). It's not a matter of perfectionism, it's a matter of that simple problem which I've been harping on about for like 5 years now. >_>
Give me that, and then we can worry about fixing the non-gamebreaking problems later. I'll recruit people myself, I'll run storylines; just give me a reason to think it's worth my time.
Edit: ohey vad