Consolidated Discussion of RPG Mechanics

[Jonathan Meer]

So, TLDR: I think system repurposing is entirely tied to making people want to write with/about each other.

I agree with this.

For your interest: http://cdbzrpg.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28048

[Super Buu]

I've read through everything in this thread, and there's so many golden ideas I don't know where to start. It'll probably be easier just to say what I disagree with.

Chieves make me feel a little icky. I don't mind them, and awards can be fun to collect (not to mention adding another addictive RPG element), but if they grant any more than trivial amounts of Prestige/XP/whatever I'd be opposed.

I like universal currency, I've always argued for a system where you buy into PL separately. I disagree with Orion that having people just pump into PL and ignore techniques is a problem. Speaking IC-wise, I see techniques and such as just being a different kind of power. They still improve your chances of winning. Guldo might not have been strong, but time stop let him be a badass. There are lots of other examples, though it's more prominent in Dragon Ball where battles were more based on that than pure power. So if people want to pump PL, let 'em, that's just a certain kind of strong.

That's about all I outright disagree with. Now for other stuff!

I think there's a lot to be said for keeping things fairly simple and understandable, and there are also the factors of the necessity of coding some of those ideas. With that in mind, I do like the idea of relative returns (definitely for reasons Mario stated I prefer it to decaying PL), but I don't think it would be necessary if you:

1) Reducing the rate of XP gain. Perhaps half of what it is now.
5) Raising the 'floor' of starting CA. A lot of the higher up people are now 10x stronger than newbies. This sucks for newbies. A lot. It takes a ton of effort to even get 1000 CA, much less the 5000 to 'compete.'

I think those are the most important things, and should be implemented regardless of what happens with everything else.

I do like relative returns, though. However if they were able to be implemented, I think the effects should be very slight, limited mostly to bonuses for those of lower PL (so no reducing the amount of XP strong folks get, sticking to the idea that incentives work better than disincentives). And preferably it should only kick in once there's an actual power gap to speak of, like if players are starting to reach double the starting PL. But if that's too difficult to implement, you can always just raise the starting PL from time to time, so that the gap doesn't get out of control.

Should also emphasize as others have done that relative returns should only affect PL. So maybe if you're in the 'newbie gains' PL range, PL costs half as much but everything else still costs the normal amount of XP/Prestige.

Adding more interactivity, quests and world events are something that I don't think anyone could complain about. A large part of that is simply having good, active staffers that know what they're allowed to do. Simple but not easy.

I'm not so sure about bringing back canons at this point. I think it would be better to simply have them interact more. I'd love to continue as Super Buu, but reviving canons would mean fucking up previous continuity and/or resetting the entire world. I guess I need to give this one more thought.

Whilst what Rem/Piper said about new blood is true and probably more important than this, I do genuinely believe gameplay mechanics will make a difference. If I know that a system is bound to decay eventually (as I've always felt with the current system, due to the rising power gaps), I don't particularly want to make a huge investment in it. And yeah, you can fix that problem by removing CA outright. But I think most people would agree, there's more to success than a lack of problems.

[Rem-13]

I don't think system changes aren't worth discussing, I'm just impressing the fact that they alone aren't going to save the RPG. Again my original thought of Acquisition and Retention. Both important but we were only discussing the second.

[Sigfried Hunin]

I don't see any point at all in talking about getting new members until the current members are happy and writing a little more. They won't stay if we aren't active as a senior base.

[Alexander Trafford]

I have a brilliant idea that will solve everything. Listen very closely now as I whisper these words of wisdom. Instead of logging on to this website and writing pages upon pages within these 'change' threads, how about we all funnel that energy into roleplaying? Mostly everyone who was written in these threads has expressed the desire to continue roleplaying, yet only Orion, Meer, and maybe a few others have actually shown their desire to write.

I understand that I too am guilty of this. But, as I have said in prior threads, I will continue roleplaying as soon as I finish applying to law school. And you can all hold me to that.

[Sigfried Hunin]

I've been writing lol

[Sigfried Hunin]

In response to Rose:

I think if anything you should leave XP alone or even INCREASE it's accumulation speed while drastically reducing the PL increase rate and, as you suggested, increase the starting PL. That is, if we're going to go the "easier" route, which either way it's been propositioned, will still make it hard for people to catch up. I mean, if Kaden started out a x and then wrote y, he is still y over any of the starting writers. It doesn't really change the issue at hand that much unless you make the starting PL so high that almost all of the increases are trivial.

[Jonathan Meer]

wtf

[Tyr]

I have a brilliant idea that will solve everything. Listen very closely now as I whisper these words of wisdom. Instead of logging on to this website and writing pages upon pages within these 'change' threads, how about we all funnel that energy into roleplaying? Mostly everyone who was written in these threads has expressed the desire to continue roleplaying, yet only Orion, Meer, and maybe a few others have actually shown their desire to write.

I understand that I too am guilty of this. But, as I have said in prior threads, I will continue roleplaying as soon as I finish applying to law school. And you can all hold me to that.

I thought the whole idea of this thread was to actually get these people back by making changes that would make them roleplay, not simply expend energy that would otherwise have been used to roleplay. Fat chance that any of these new implementations will be retroactive, that would be far too much work (from the ideas I've seen suggested so far).

[Rebekah]

Just exclude those of us who have been writing this entire time from that statement.

[Super Buu]

In response to Rose:

I think if anything you should leave XP alone or even INCREASE it's accumulation speed while drastically reducing the PL increase rate and, as you suggested, increase the starting PL.

Yeah you're right, for some reason I got PL and XP mixed up. What I meant was decrease the rate of PL increase.

[Rem-13]

I think the changing of the RPG is most important to the people who arent writing don't you Alex? Why would the RPG need an alteration if the roster was full of happy writers?

[Alexander Trafford]

Are you honestly going to write even if these changes are implemented? I thought not.

[Celena]

In my opinion the main reason people stopped rp'ing is because our characters are too segregated. There's nothing that brings us together apart from a seasonal saga which we now a days get once a year. It's obvious what needs to be the main priority.

[Sigfried Hunin]

I think everybody is slowly coming to that conclusion.

I think once the dust settles we should all bounce in on a huge thingy. That'd be sick.

[Rem-13]

Are you honestly going to write even if these changes are implemented? I thought not.

Way to completely sidestep the logic of my statement and go for ad hominem. Can you go through a single discussion without attacking people? Nope. Difference is what I say might actually help the RPG, while you'll just go on being a dick for sake of being a dick.

Now, I reassert, who are these changes for if not those who are not roleplaying? If 'just write' was viable everyone'd be cranking out 5,000 word rps regularly. Unfortunately there are innumerable factors that go into the equation that decides whether a person feels like writing. I'm sure you are aware, if one does not feel like writing then they aren't going to enjoy writing, and if they don't enjoy it then what's the point? What this thread is attempting to do is create an environment that is most conductive to enjoyable writing as possible.

To this end I think activity begets activity, and I think that new members with youthful vigor will bring out the life in our more venerable roleplayers over the long term, but I completely agree that short term adjustments are needed to get things rolling right now.

Now following this, I think that either canon members are needed to draw in those new members, or else we need to reach out to a different branch and become a different RPG entirely. I haven't heard a better solution to the new member problem.

[Celena]

What may help in this situation is for everyone here to think back to when they were a newbie. What about the site at the time did you find the most attractive? For me it was all the alliances and the bad blood and rivalries between certain characters. We need these aspects of the rpg to be brought back.

[Vad]

My love for DBZ.

[Rem-13]

I joined because I wanted to play as a DBZ character, and I had hoped around on many before that. I stayed because of how much fun I had role-playing with Android-16 and Goten. I couldn't wait to get on AIM after school and discuss where we were taking our story next. The system wasn't going to make me stay, but my friends were.

[Jonathan Meer]

I loved DBZ, and the stats-based aspect of it, as well as the (eventually fleeting) belief that someone was actually reading all this shit.

Reason why I don't write so much

1) RL. It's real. Not total, not sufficient, but it's there. Which is to say, I have more fun yanking my johnson and playing L4D2.

2) Atmosphere. I have no idea what Chubbs is now. Don't feel connected. Not getting any vibes, either from the community as a whole, or from other characters. I'm too damn comfortable with everyone here. New people, I don't care to get to know (and I have no reason to get to know them). Old people, I've wrangled with them before.

3) Jon Meer =/= Krillin. I love Jon, and there's plenty I can do with him, but my memories with this place are firmly attached to Krillin. Something about that connection made it so much more significant. There was a common mythology, made so much more tangible by the fact that my character has a significant (perhaps never referenced) history in print already. But Jon is Jon. No history. Very hard to explain what I mean here. Very much connected to point 2.

4) I'll be honest, I haven't found the last couple sagas very interesting, and sagas are kinda the driving deal. Not that I spent a whole lot of time looking into them. They all just seem too structured and planned out. Pick Your Own Adventure was fun in second grade.

5) wtf is there to DO? Train? For what? The dragonballs? Then I get to make a wish...for what?

Ultimately, my Chubbs experience right now is marked by a certain nihilism. That's translating to an extent into my character (who, since fashioned upon the brainchild of a certain Mr. Friedrich Nietzsche, actually benefits from that), but it isn't the sort of thing that drives one to write.

And I'm 21 years old. I was 15 when I joined. I'm not going to be a 30 year old man, writing on this forum; things have to stop sometime. But I haven't really changed all that much; I still love DBZ, I still love the adrenaline lurch of writing with other people (in dangerous situations), and I still love the community.

Things are down atm, but judging from the huge amount of input here, I'm not concerned about the future of Chubbs. Some changes probably need to happen, but I think it's quite clear now that there is still a lot of spirit in the old nag.