Moves

[Aqua]

Of course there's a correlation between strength and best moves. There always has been. If a Joe, with a PL of 5, and Bob, with a PL of 500, shoot beams at each other, Bob would win. That's how it goes. That's the point of having stats at all.

I didn't realize that connection wasn't obvious.

That is obvious, and I've mentioned as much in this thread:

Otherwise, you get a person who is devoting all their TP to moves and they aren't losing anything in the trade off because 1) there's no limit to how many moves they can have and/ or 2) there is no real limit to the power of these moves aside from the ambiguous idea that (I'm stronger than you, so my blast wins...).

Additionally, just having a move adds nothing to a character. Raditzu used to have many moves that I never even tried to use. If Retane wants 22 moves, great. Its still up to him to make use of them. There certainly isn't a rule anywhere that says if you're fighting another player you have to use all of their Best Moves and base their strength off of some imaginary scale that has nothing to do with stats.

I alos think you are looking at this in terms of blasting power. Yes, with a max ki / best move strength correlation, we can RP in a way that stacking up on moves seems harmless. But if someone is stacking up on moves that don't do damage (like moves that distract, hide, etc.) there is no check or balance on this. It's pretty much an auto-succeed. The use the move and, because stat efficiency has nothing to do with move efficiency, these types of moves can unabated. Ergo, a person who "sacrifices" TP for a ton of these types of moves, sacrifices very little to get an entire arsenal of moves.

Even if we did re-implement a mechanic that says "you can only have 1 move for every 50 insight" there's still the same "problem" you're describing. The strength a Best Moves have always been based on stats and will always be based on stats, regardless of whether or not you need another 50 Insight to get another one. What else would you gauge their strength on?

True, but at least there would be cap to the number of moves. I mentioned that we either need to limit the amount of moves someone can have on a stat (so you don't get a situation like the one I just mentioned) AND/ OR we need to make move strength correlate to stat strength. Personally, I think having both is best but it's VERY complicated to pull off and I don't think it's necessary for the minimalist approach that's conducive with chubbs culture. Simply capping off best move slots, I think, would at least make certain that a character has the ability to use their plethora of moves.

I don't really see how you got from being able to have more best moves to being able to just turn on god mode.

Have you seen Retane RP? No offense Retane... but still...

A best move is just a technique that is unique (ish) to your character. It doesn't suddenly propel them to higher realms of strength. They're primarily RP fodder. You're welcome to add more to your character, but that doesn't mean you'll be allowed to god mode just because you want to.

Think of it this way: We make characters pay zeni for items, right? Why don't we just let everyone have any amount of items that they want? Because items, like best moves, are not just RP fodder. They offer a character a distinctive edge. The difference between paying 10tp for a best move and the price of an item is that the price of an item is proportional to it's worth, while the 10tp per move is not. No matter the power or effectiveness of a best move, it costs 10tp. Also remember that my main concern here is not with attack style moves, but axillary moves that deceive, effect the mind, etc.

Again, god moding is never going to be something we allow. Additionally, there's nothing that says your opponent has to use any best moves you have. If you want to work them into a fight, great, but your opponent is more than welcome to turn around and do the exact same thing to you.

That's great. Let's think about this, I have to spend 12 tp to raise one stat 3 points. Retane's character spends 10tp and gets a new move. What system do we have in place to compare my +3 agility (for example) to his new move? None. The basic point is this, the current cost of best moves is disproportionate to the gain. There's no reason for a stronger character to throw mountains of TP into training to minimally raise their stats, when they can just stack up on moves.

And what I was saying, in terms of me stacking up on best moves, is that if nothing changes, it's in my character's best interest to spend all my TP on moves. Instead of dropping 20tp to raise each stat +1, I can add a move that shrouds the entire area in a darkness that only I can see through and a move that let's me set energy land mines (for example). Which seems like the better trade off to you? Now extrapolate that.

That was taken out of context. You want to implement a game mechanic that serves no real purpose in the game. Your justification so far has because it "makes sense" to you and you seem to be operating under some guidelines that state "best moves > anything else." That never has, and never will be, the case.

That isn't my point at all. I've clarified above.

All the characters on Chubbs have stats. Ergo the things they are capable of are based on stats. Best Moves do not change this. The only thing Best Moves do are give people a premise for their character to be able to do something unique.

What stat does retane rely on when he cloaks the opponent in darkness (I'm sorry if I'm remembering one of his moves wrong, but you get the idea...)? What stat does Aqua rely on to freeze time, or use his baptism technique? There's no stat correlation, and with the current system a character can omit boosting stats and stack up on best moves that do not correlate to max ki (like the one's I've just mentioned).

We've never allowed people to have best moves like "this makes Jon power up stronger than anyone else in the universe, but is tiring and he gets sad when its done." We don't let people have best moves that are unbalanced or game-breaking (as it were) and we're not going to start.

Clearly, no one's going to get away with a best move that's little more than a transformation. That isn't the concern.