Afterlife Overhaul?

[Kaden]

I'm not upset.

o.o

[Juno]

I am in favor, first of all, of quests to enhance the afterlife. I always felt like I could prosper in the afterlife, if I wanted to, but there was always that dread of what other people complained of: having nothing to do. Which is why, in a nutshell, I think quests are good, not just for the afterlife, but for everything; it gives people something to do, especially if they don't particularly have that much motivation to write a big, epic plotline at that moment. And, heck, it might jumpstart them onto aforementioned big, epic plot-line.

As far as the buff / debuff system, I think that it is one of the most influential things to come out of Meer's saga; it could, potentially, serve as a reward for quests and personal storylines. Of course, this would also encourage more reading; incorporated with the community grading system proposed, people could vote for a person to be buffed or debuffed, and staff could discuss what exactly that would be. (Speaking of the community grading system, is it still being discussed?)

Back to the Afterlife, though. I like your revolving door idea, Kaden, I really do, but I'm not sure I like the idea of allowing someone to immediately get themselves out of there. Regardless of anything else, I still view the afterlife as a game mechanic, in some sense, because of how integral the idea of death is in a universe where tons of warriors blow things up all the time. I think there should be a time-limit as to how long someone should stay there (not long; one or two weeks, maximum) because that would either motivate them to do something and use the Afterlife for the opportunities it gives (once again, quests would be put in place to fight writer's block) or to be "punished" through the loss of the opportunity to gain CA through roleplaying during that block of time.

In my opinion, the afterlife offers opportunities that aren't exploited because people don't know where to start. I like the idea of people being able to back out of death if they seriously can't get through it, but I am against advocating a lack of effort on peoples' part. I think that with a bit of tweaking, the afterlife could be seen as an advantage as opposed to a disadvantage. I don't like the idea of someone dying in a saga, an event which could be an integral part of my character's continuity if they are close, and then just reviving themselves immediately and pretending like nothing happened.

EDIT: This post doesn't flow very well. I hope my points got across.

[Josh]

I'm not upset.

o.o

Dude I thought you were gonna make Vad cry.

Meh, he needs some hair on his chest anyway ;D.

On second though, I disagree with you and Vad. Characters who die in Saga's should be perma killed.

[Juno]

Dude I thought you were gonna make Vad cry.

Meh, he needs some hair on his chest anyway ;D.

On second though, I disagree with you and Vad. Characters who die in Saga's should be perma killed.

Like, never-come-back perma killed?

Now that sounds like an activity killer. xD

[Victoria]

I just want to say that I really, really like the simplistic idea of debuffs...I also like:

EDIT: Might be reasonable to leave that up to the community, as per grading. If someone wants to just skip out of the afterlife with no roleplaying at all, that incurs a hefty debuff. If someone wants to leave the afterlife after a significant amount of activity there, the debuff may be lesser, or non-existent.

The currency idea is awesome but this is so much less word. We might be able to incorperate the currency idea into the afterlife still, maybe for afterlife abilities?

All I know is this debuff idea puts death as a penalty BUT makes people have the option of continuing or going to the afterlife.

[Vad]

Dude I thought you were gonna make Vad cry.

Meh, he needs some hair on his chest anyway ;D.

On second though, I disagree with you and Vad. Characters who die in Saga's should be perma killed.

I can't help it. It's in my nature to worry. I guess I'll just go along with this buff debuff system. At least I got the discussion started.

[Kaden]

Don't go along with something just because you don't know how to respond to someone.

If you think not enough of your system has been explained, then continue explaining it until you're satisfied with it. Don't just quit for the sake of quitting.

[Vad]

Don't go along with something just because you don't know how to respond to someone.

If you think not enough of your system has been explained, then continue explaining it until you're satisfied with it. Don't just quit for the sake of quitting.

=/ I know. I'll spend more time on it tonight. I'll have a revised system ready by 4 AM.

[Piper Juunanagou]

I like the ideas in the OP. I see them as attempts to give the afterlife some actual character in par with the living realm. While I'd admit that under the current system, I would never want to die, I nonetheless wouldn't like to see the afterlife reduced to a pointless thing. It just suffers the same fate as the in-character boards in that it lacks anything to make people give a shit about it or feel any attachment to it. Add to that the fact that it's an onerous task to come back to life, and you have one shitty place that no one wants to be stuck at.

So yea, I'm for expanding the afterlife, and I think the idea Vad outlined is a nice place to start.

[Alexander Trafford]

OP's plans + easier mechanisms to be revived if one wished to be revived (briefly outline in OP) = Boss afterlife.

[Jarka]

OP's plans + easier mechanisms to be revived if one wished to be revived (briefly outline in OP) = Boss afterlife.

I like the ideas in the OP. I see them as attempts to give the afterlife some actual character in par with the living realm. While I'd admit that under the current system, I would never want to die, I nonetheless wouldn't like to see the afterlife reduced to a pointless thing.
...
So yea, I'm for expanding the afterlife, and I think the idea Vad outlined is a nice place to start.

This. I think, especially if the questing system is being put into place in the IC living forums, that Vad's post is a nice jumping off point. I also like the idea of a minimum time in Afterlife so that it does carry some weight rather than just poofing back to life because you don't feel like RPing in hell, but not having phenomenal requirements to come back to life when the time has expired.

While I like the idea of continuing buffs/debuffs, I don't think they should replace death as a mechanic or even really deal with it. I think they should stay fluid RP fodder, which is how I've viewed them so far.

But, what do I know.

[Orion]

I'm a fan of keeping the afterlife as a place of roleplaying, but definitely piss off this ridiculous system we have at the moment. Easier is usually better, but if a little more complex garners interest in people for the afterlife, then that should also be considered. The afterlife needs to be fun and it needs to have the restrictions lessened (but not removed, imo) to come back to life. Right now, it's a giant writer's block and it takes a lot of dedicated roleplaying (a fucking year for me) while you're generally all alone, which takes a bit of the joy of roleplaying on a community site.

I don't see the need for people to need to buy Medallions to resurrect; we could put a flat Heaven/Hell points cost to it. Make it so that it could be attained within a suitable amount of time (read: a few months at most). I like the ideas of being able to buy a week life on any planet, it would at least give people a chance to see people in the mortal realm without spending zeni (even though they can't now anyway when dead) and I can also see some nice rping opportunities with it too. Making just a debuff is a little boring.

There's no reason why the afterlife can't be an entertaining place to roleplay if you do die, and while I think there needs to be alterations, I think Vad's idea is an excellent starting point.

[Kaden]

Make it so that it could be attained within a suitable amount of time (read: a few months at most).

Relativity at its finest. I don't think getting out of Heaven really requires all that much. We both know there were plenty of times where you could have been writing to get out of Heaven sooner but you chose to write Orion's history. And look at it, if half that effort had gone into actually trying to get out as quickly as possible, it definitely wouldn't have taken you more than a couple months.

EDIT: Re-read the OP again. What I had already written isn't really relevant, but I'll condense it if someone wants to read it anyway.[spoiler]

To address something in the OP: why differentiate currencies between Heaven and Hell? Why not just do everything with a single currency? Call it... I dunno... Life Points or something. Completing Quests (regardless of Heaven/Hell) earns LP and it is later spent to revive. Lets say I die and go to Heaven. I quest there until I earn enough LP to come back to life. Because of the way the rewards worked out, though, I end up with... 2 extra. I die again and am sent to Hell this time. Instead of starting completely from scratch, I would already have 2 LP towards my next revival.

You'd need to say something like, if you have enough LP to pay for a revival, you can't earn anymore Quest rewards (so you could still RP in the Afterlife if you wanted to, but wouldn't be able to stockpile enough LP to just walk in and out of death a dozen times) and if one part of the Afterlife is supposed to be harder to get out of than the other, you can reflect that in the revival cost. If you're in Heaven, revival is 8 LP, but if you're in Hell it costs 12. Or whatever.

While I still don't like the idea of adding additional currencies, there are ways to keep it from being more cumbersome than it needs to be.[/spoiler]

Like I said, I reread the OP and the first question I asked was: why not use zeni? Instead of making up a currency system to fit the needs, why not use the one we have? The consensus is that there isn't anything to do with zeni and that its too hard to get. Well here's a great place to use it and people seem to think it will be easy enough to get. Its easy enough to make up reasons for why it would make sense IC, and the one rule we have about it can certainly be changed.

[Orion]

Relativity at its finest. I don't think getting out of Heaven really requires all that much. We both know there were plenty of times where you could have been writing to get out of Heaven sooner but you chose to write Orion's history. And look at it, if half that effort had gone into actually trying to get out as quickly as possible, it definitely wouldn't have taken you more than a couple months.

I don't think you're intentionally trying to sound snippy, but that's how it's coming off. Yes I realise I could've gotten out far sooner, but my point is that there was no motivation to with the four temples I had to grind through to do it. Thus, I chose something more interesting to do. If the afterlife was fun to do, then I was just putting an arbitrary time limit on what I think it should take to save up the points. For someone who works hard, I definitely think it should be less.

To address something in the OP: why differentiate currencies between Heaven and Hell? Why not just do everything with a single currency?

As I read it, it's mostly for flavour. Both Heaven and Hell currencies would purchase the same things, eg. resurrection is 1000 points. You could get out with 1000 Heaven, 1000 Hell or 500 of each.

[Vad]

To address something in the OP: why differentiate currencies between Heaven and Hell? Why not just do everything with a single currency?

In my head that's actually what I had called it at first, but then I thought "What could we add to allow for further expansion and customization?" Well, with a currency for both Heaven and Hell you could do different things in each area. Heaven points being only spendable there and so on with Hell Points. They would be combinable so if you had 500 of each you could combine it to buy your way out of the Afterlife (assuming 1000 points was required). I also thought it might be neat to have certain items that you can get in the Afterlife that are unique to it. So when you return to the living you have something to represent your hard work. Maybe a better version of the headband for PP?

The single currency can be worked into doing all of this, but it's more of a "Do we want that added flavor or not?"

The idea behind resetting your points upon resurrection was that I was thinking the rewards could be rather hefty. So if you wanted to buy items and then buy your way out you could. I do like the idea of capping it at the resurrection price though.

EDIT: Back to your Buff/Debuff thing. What if we put in temporary purchasable Buffs in both the Afterlife and Regular CC shop. Then we could sell grenades and such that give Debuffs. Just food for thought I guess.

[Kaden]

I don't think you're intentionally trying to sound snippy, but that's how it's coming off. Yes I realise I could've gotten out far sooner, but my point is that there was no motivation to with the four temples I had to grind through to do it. Thus, I chose something more interesting to do. If the afterlife was fun to do, then I was just putting an arbitrary time limit on what I think it should take to save up the points. For someone who works hard, I definitely think it should be less.

I wasn't trying to sound snippy, I was trying to make a point. Interest is relative. There's a lot that I could do with the temple quests to get out of Heaven. Honestly, if there were four Quests offered that were exactly like the Temples, and they would get me out of the Afterlife, I would go for them in a heartbeat.

Yes, it took you a while, but in your post you translated that into "it takes too long to get out of Heaven." A more accurate representation would be something like "I don't find the Temples interesting, so I didn't want to RP." Painting a negative picture of what's already there is disingenuous to the process. That's all I was trying to get across.

As I read it, it's mostly for flavour. Both Heaven and Hell currencies would purchase the same things, eg. resurrection is 1000 points. You could get out with 1000 Heaven, 1000 Hell or 500 of each.

Read my edit.

Same to Vad.

[Vad]

I



Read my edit.

I'll read yours if you read mine. =D

[Waffuru]

Karma points. Awarded by quests, both while alive and dead, in which you receive either positive or negative points. The amount of points awarded from quests should be greater in the Afterlife though. Then we can have shops in Heaven/Hell to spend karma points (negative points in hell, positive in heaven but you'd be unable to cross 0 through purchase). We can put whatever in the shops, including resurrection.

Then I think after a time spent dead allow a loan or a reduced price resurrection to avoid people becoming trapped/inactive.

I think this would also let us add some more flavor to the quests and to stop people from just like doing quests to kill babies and then instantly turn around and work at a soup kitchen. Which would make no sense, unless they are serving dead baby soup.

[Victoria]

I like the Karma point idea. I think it could work well, and, allow people to stick to the good/evil roles. Making a whole "shop" with revive in it would work also, rather than making two seperate items, make one currency.

[Rafael]

Personally dig the whole "If you RP enough about anything, be it a quest to get out or whatever you feel like in the Afterlife, you can maneuver your way back to life(dunno about any particulars, such as x posts or word req or w/e). This allows unique thought on mechanics to get out as opposed to

Hell: Get teh evil Dragonballs
Heaven: Temples
KK: KK quests, as it were.

Also like the idea about special Afterlife Shops where you can buy items unique to that half of the game, I.E. for example, with X amount of good karma/heaven points w/e you buy, for instance,

Halo: After extensive time spent in Heaven, you have gained a unique head adornment that makes it easier to activate your Tier Transformations, reducing the PP costs by 1

Or something like that, just first thing to pop into my head.

Personally prefer the word "Karma," and there's nothing wrong with dead baby soup.