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Krillin · 07-17-2007, 04:51 AM

Precisely my point, Rad. Guitar can only do one or the other. Piano offers either a contrast, or a bolster.

I've touched a guitar, Pigero. I've played it. Little more than picking out chords and figuring out bits from some of my favorite songs, but I can fiddle with it. I hate playing it. I'm used to the piano, which, to my apparently untrained ears, seems so much fuller when played correctly than a guitar.

If you forced me to play piano with one hand, then you might have an argument for guitar > piano. But as long as both hands are working fine, I don't think there's any competition.

As for the idea that more notes means better, that's just silliness. I doubt that brain can properly interpret that many notes, and even if it could, there's no way any guitarist can put feeling and emotion into each of the 30 or 40 notes he's playing per second. It'd just be overwhelming, and probably somewhat awesome, but not exactly mindblowing musically.

To be honest (and I know this is going to catch some serious flack), I've always seen the sort of rock most of you like as the equivalent of musical junk food. It's food, and it works, and it tastes different than home-made stuff, but it's got very little actual depth. I'm definitely not one of those classical-only enthusiasts (I can't stand the music majors from my school who know everything about Purcell, and have never heard of Green Day), but rock has never really made me think outside of the box. Avant-garde, it isn't (though it seems like it should be).

Pigero · 07-17-2007, 06:44 AM

The Cool Tapion Wrote:The more notes you play does not mean the better. Sure you have speed and accuracy, but I don't really like it when people just play random shit on guitar. It never sounds really that good. It is just a bunch of notes thrown into the air basically, while piano makes it sound beautiful and the fact that you can do bass notes and higher notes on piano while guitar you can only do so much at once makes the piano a little bit better.

We are talking about song generalization. At soloing, the guitar is probably better, sure, but overall, any song played on the guitar can be played on piano and sound amazing. It doesn't work the same the other way.

Beethoven and Mozart don't sound that good on guitar while Tool sounds amazing on piano.

On a song generalization, piano wins. And all of the people saying "you've never touched a guitar, you don't know!" well, have you touched a piano? Have you actually PLAYED piano. Hitting random notes or knowing one song does not mean you are a pianist. You don't understand the piano, hence why you as well, don't understand the instrument.

I've played and am learning both. I have a friend teaching me piano when he can. This friend also scored a 34 on his ACT while in 8th grade. He is a true genius amongst people. He understand the piano and he understands music.

The only reason I posted NPS's is because what'shisface said that Piano can go about 10 notes at a time, whereas Guitar could do much less (basically 3-4 notes in a single chord). Alls I was saying that Guitar can plug in 60 notes a second without sounding like muddy shit, whereas Piano can go to what?

I posted a whole argument right here, but I figured I'd prevent tensions from raising high, cos I know some Piano...Musical...Liberator would just repeat what was said before, and I'd tell them to come up with a new argument, and we'd end up hating each other....

btw, who said classical music isn't good on guitar?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=2xjJXT0C0X4

Pigero · 07-17-2007, 06:47 AM

Krillin Wrote:Precisely my point, Rad. Guitar can only do one or the other. Piano offers either a contrast, or a bolster.

I've touched a guitar, Pigero. I've played it. Little more than picking out chords and figuring out bits from some of my favorite songs, but I can fiddle with it. I hate playing it. I'm used to the piano, which, to my apparently untrained ears, seems so much fuller when played correctly than a guitar.

If you forced me to play piano with one hand, then you might have an argument for guitar > piano. But as long as both hands are working fine, I don't think there's any competition.

As for the idea that more notes means better, that's just silliness. I doubt that brain can properly interpret that many notes, and even if it could, there's no way any guitarist can put feeling and emotion into each of the 30 or 40 notes he's playing per second. It'd just be overwhelming, and probably somewhat awesome, but not exactly mindblowing musically.

To be honest (and I know this is going to catch some serious flack), I've always seen the sort of rock most of you like as the equivalent of musical junk food. It's food, and it works, and it tastes different than home-made stuff, but it's got very little actual depth. I'm definitely not one of those classical-only enthusiasts (I can't stand the music majors from my school who know everything about Purcell, and have never heard of Green Day), but rock has never really made me think outside of the box. Avant-garde, it isn't (though it seems like it should be).

Do you realize that there's 6 (or 5, 7, or 12) strings on every fret? You can add all the "Contrast" you damn want.

I didn't wanna play this card, because I tend to hate public opinion, but if the guitar isn't a more useful instrument, why don't we hear any piano in heavy metal?

***Raditzu*** · 07-17-2007, 07:56 AM

Pigero Wrote:Do you realize that there's 6 (or 5, 7, or 12) strings on every fret? You can add all the "Contrast" you damn want.

You only have two hands, dude. That means one of the frets and one strumming. Piano doesn't suffer from that physical limitation in the same way. And I'm using the term "suffer" here relatively.

And you need to chill. No one is attacking the guitar, or saying its a bad instrument. There has not been a single word spoken that says the guitar is a bad instrument or that it is not a versatile one.

If don't understand what's being said, you're better just not posting and saving yourself some face.

Waffuru · 07-17-2007, 10:18 AM

Krillin Wrote:To be honest (and I know this is going to catch some serious flack), I've always seen the sort of rock most of you like as the equivalent of musical junk food.

I hardly think that's the fault of the genre. I think if you actually cared to look into it you'd find a pretty decent sized group of musicians who play some flavor of rock but with as much fullness and depth as you'd see in any classical piece. I know of several bands that toured backed by a symphony.

plus, glockenspiel > piano

Krillin · 07-17-2007, 03:09 PM

Probably true, Waff. I'm pretty heavy into some soft rock and alternative, but listening to the stuff of Guitar Hero on its own is just repulsive. Guess it's just personal taste.

The Not Cool Not Tapion · 07-17-2007, 05:40 PM

Pigero Wrote:The only reason I posted NPS's is because what'shisface said that Piano can go about 10 notes at a time, whereas Guitar could do much less (basically 3-4 notes in a single chord). Alls I was saying that Guitar can plug in 60 notes a second without sounding like muddy shit, whereas Piano can go to what?

I posted a whole argument right here, but I figured I'd prevent tensions from raising high, cos I know some Piano...Musical...Liberator would just repeat what was said before, and I'd tell them to come up with a new argument, and we'd end up hating each other....

btw, who said classical music isn't good on guitar?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=2xjJXT0C0X4

You are ignorant.

That is not classical music anymore. It is great, I've heard it several times and learned the beginning to it, but it was converted to the guitar, picked up in tempo. Have you ever heard the real Canon? Beautiful peace, you've heard it, everybody has. But JerryC made it fun and exciting, and a guitar solo. It's really well done, but is not classical music.

Classical music is full of emotion whereas, most rock you think of doesn't show that emotion. I get emotion from acoustic guitar when I play it, but I get more from something like Moonlight Sonata.

Kami · 07-17-2007, 06:18 PM

Music is very, very complicated.

Krillin · 07-17-2007, 06:22 PM

Score! I skipped that link because I was like "I'll bet it's Canon Rock. That's, like, the only example someone can readily find on the Internet."

I have ESP.

***Raditzu*** · 07-17-2007, 06:22 PM

Not nearly as complicated as people make it.

Kami · 07-17-2007, 06:24 PM

Raditzu Wrote:Not nearly as complicated as people make it.

Word.

i.e. these goons

***Raditzu*** · 07-17-2007, 06:26 PM

Or just anyone who thinks they have all the answers.

Which tends to be far more people than it should.

Kami · 07-17-2007, 06:39 PM

Raditzu Wrote:Or just anyone who thinks they have all the answers.

Which tends to be far more people than it should.

Yep. It's a hard thing for some people to realize, their opinions meld into facts and then they sound like a jackass like me!

Bojack · 07-17-2007, 07:17 PM

The Cool Tapion Wrote:Classical music is full of emotion whereas, most rock you think of doesn't show that emotion. I get emotion from acoustic guitar when I play it, but I get more from something like Moonlight Sonata.

Raditzu Wrote:You only have two hands, dude. That means one of the frets and one strumming. Piano doesn't suffer from that physical limitation in the same way.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5YqNYhmSK2o

Show me something a guitar can't do and I will either a) give up, or b) show you you are wrong. I'm not arguing which is the better instrument, that's just fucking silly. I just don't like seeing people underestimating the guitar's versatility. The fact that it contributes to more genres than piano has/ever will is testament to it's versatility.

Bojack · 07-17-2007, 07:20 PM

Kami Wrote:Hahahaha. I have an acoustic too. When are you guys doing it?

Evan works from 2 to 6 or something. I have school in the morning. Best best would be to stop being anti social and get on AIM every now and then. >.<

I want to hear Pigero play so fucking bad. I want to get my face melted. Or laugh at how much he's been lying about this guitar skills.

Krillin · 07-17-2007, 07:36 PM

Bojack Wrote:piano can't do this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=_nqL1g_TWrw
or this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=zlVODiYiAYw

Piano could pull both of those things off. It wouldn't sound at all the same, and it's not the sort of thing the instrument is suited for, but it could still do it, and it would probably sound just fine with some tweaking.

Bojack · 07-17-2007, 07:43 PM

Krillin Wrote:Piano could pull both of those things off. It wouldn't sound at all the same, and it's not the sort of thing the instrument is suited for, but it could still do it, and it would probably sound just fine with some tweaking.

Examples?

Krillin · 07-17-2007, 07:50 PM

I don't have any. I can tell you from my relatively short piano experience, however, that what is done on those guitars CAN be done on a piano. Again, it won't sound at all the same, but it can be done.

'Course, those two examples are electric, and if memory serves, we've pretty much focused on the acoustic elements of both.

Bojack · 07-17-2007, 07:56 PM

I'm not. Electric guitar is still guitar. Keyboard can't be compared because of what I said (it's a big ass database of sounds, it doesn't count).

Kami come in Vent. I see you posting. =(

Krillin · 07-17-2007, 07:57 PM

What the fuck? That's bullshit. Electric guitar is still guitar, but electric piano isn't piano?

You haven't a clue what you're talking about. Not a fucking clue.

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