Pie vs. Cak3

[Minoshia]

Edited out

[Raditzu]

That's fine, Aqua.

[Nori]

turnover 2morrow plz

[Dehan]

^what's that supposed to mean?

I'm glad Aqua asked, when I saw Krillin's comment I jumped the boat and was like 'WOOHOO TURNOVER BABY TIME TO BUST OUT MY CUSTOM!'...even though I would've had to start from scratch since I deleted my old document but anyway yea just thought I'd get that out there that if he hadn't of asked it that I probably would have.

[Krillin]

Heh, if this sort of an attitude pervades your sexual constitution, your wedding night is going to be very, very short.

[Android-18]

Krillin, that's the kind of comments you should stop posting. Seriously.

[Reijin]

Its not that anyone is being purposely confusing about the subject. Its that regardless of whatever "definite" answer one might give for the time being, no one knows what might arise in the future for possible review or discussion. Its a part of a game's process. When circumstances change, the staff here will adjust the website accordingly as they feel is necessary or helpful to the site. The current line of thought, from what I've read in these replies (NO, I'M NOT IN THE DAMN LOOP, I COME HERE LIKE ONCE A MONTH AND CAN'T EVEN REMEMBER HALF THE THINGS FROM HERE, IE PASSWORD) is that "No, there is no turnover going to happen within any time in the forseeable future". This doesn't translate to "NO NEVER" so much as "There are no current plans for this. If this changes, we will alert you all in more than ample notice." I see this as fair, imo.

[Aqua]

Well, Reijin, I had not really seen this most recent answer until I made this thread, not since the "official turnover" stance post. But that official post seemed ambiguous to me then, so it only stands to reason that I would have a question now. “Indefinite,” by definition, means unclear or vague. Yet, in the official stance, it says:

The turnover has been put indefinitely on hold.

Translate that out: “The turnover has been put on hold for a vague amount of time?” What does that even mean? I didn’t know, and Krillin’s post only added to my confusion, so I asked… god help me, I asked.

And yes, having been part of staff means you know infinitely more about what has been discussed than the average member. You may not frequent the staff boards now, but that is of no consequence because having had access to the staff boards throughout the duration of turnover talks makes you much more “in the know” than any normal member ever could be. I'm not saying we should know everything that previous and current staff knows, I'm just saying that no one should bitch when we're confused as a result of mixed and/ or ambiguous signals (A concept Rad seems to grasp fully, and I appreciate that). Once again, if everyone would have just have kept silent after Waff's reply, this thread would have died. But, instead, several people needed to prove how cool they were. "Stoopid NoOb! How dare jo not know bout the reset!"

There are two points that should emerge from this thread:
1) That the reset will not come for a very long time, but when it does, the membership will be warned many months (a year) in advance.
2) The answers given by staff to members should be concise OR there should not be animosity for confusion.

In light of point 2, Reijin, if, as you said, there can be no clear "definite" answer because of the "nature of the game" then it should come as no surprise that average members, who do not possess a full knowledge of staff discussions, might be unsure about something. Again, I'm not saying that staff should have to divulge all information from the staff boards to the members, there'd be no reason for a staff board if that were the case. What I'm stressing is that everyone needs to understand that hazy subjects breed hazy understanding.

And it’s not as if I’m asking someone to look into their crystal ball and tell me the future of Chubbs. I asked for clarification from those who knew better than me.

"But staff has held a consistent position all along."
No, they haven't. We went from the reset looming, to it being an April fools joke, to debating over the specifics (which unto themselves were vast and veried), to losing the Chubbs server, to putting the reset on "indefinite hold," to it being put on the back burner but we'll have ample warning when it becomes feasible again. These, to you, might seem like subtle distinctions, but they are distinctions nonetheless, and as distinct subjects people will oft require specifics.

Like I said, Krillin said something that made me realize I did not have a full knowledge of the subject, so I inquired. Where is the harm in that? The only harm, as I see it, is everyone coming here, trying to prove how much smarter and cooler they are.

Oh Lord.

Wow, this again.

Haven't we discussed this 3049829384 times?

Aqua, just RP, stop worrying about he said/she said and leave the drama at the door

You've been given a bottom line over and over again that has been consistent, yet you refuse to accept it. It's getting ridiculous.

we're still arguing about this?

No one needs that. I got an answer, no one needs to try to push themselves up by shoving me down.

I think Krillin had something when he said (in this thread):

It has been my experience that, no matter how clear Staff makes an issue, there will always be something that the members of Chubbs have to bring up. It's as if the masses have some sort of a capacity for argument that, if left unfulfilled, desperately looks for something to argue about.

I think, though, that he meant propensity (for any rational being technically has the capacity for argument). And I also think that arguments here have less to do with ignorant members and more to do with an intolerant clique that has existed on this site for years. Ok, those of us who haven’t been here for much longer than a year get it. Super, some of you have been here for a fuckin’ long time. That doesn’t mean we’re oblivious and jo are supa kewl. It just means that we were doing something different. Not better or worse, just different. So, it would do wonders if everyone could practice a little tolerance.

[Krillin]

If the word propensity makes you feel better in there, by all means, insert it. The fact that you're arguing against my stance shows that communication happened nonetheless, in which case you're simply arguing for formal grammatical correctness in an informal debate.

Which only serves to prove my point.

[Aqua]

The definition and use of a word is not a grammatical error so much as it is a clerical error. My point wasn't to argue with your statement so much as it was to highlight, what I feel to be, a common misconception. Where you, like many others, perceive an ignorant member base with a "capacity" for argument, I perceive an aging clique with a propensity to try to make themselves feel superior. In which case, you’ve just proven my point.

[Krillin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophism

[Aqua]

http://www.iep.utm.edu/v/val-snd.htm

[Toshiro]

Not to sound rude, but the pair of you guys should shut up.

The turnover may happen some time in the future, this we all know, and the majority of us have all accepted the fact that, if we haven't, then we still go on in a cloud of doubt about it. End of the day, when the staff knows whats happening with it, we'll know. IF the staff say it's not happening yet, then it's not.

Now, please, for the love of fucking god, shut the hell up.

[Aqua]

-_- I'm not arguing about the reset... I'm just bringing to light the poor way newer members are treated when they bring something up that older members don't want to talk about.

[Janemba]

The opinions both of you are expressing aren't the problem. The fact that you just keep arguing is the problem.

[Aqua]

Jo guys win. Jo are too smart for me.

[Janemba]

This isn't a win or lose situation. It's just that at this point it's really pointless to keep arguing.

[Waffuru]

I've never used "indefinitely" to mean vague. I don't know anyone who has. Here it means "without a foreseeable end", in other words the turnover is on hold forever but not completely scrapped. Maybe someday it will happen, but there are no plans for it in the future.

[Raditzu]

I would like to address something Aqua brought up. And its something everyone should be aware of.

Yes, most of the statements, announcements, and positions the staff issue are made intentionally vague. Though it is perfectly understandable for this to cause frustration for some, it is done for the benefit of the member-base as a whole.

As stated, this is not done to be misleading or cause confusion. Its simply a matter of covering our bases. It is bad policy to promise something that can not be delivered (not that I'd really call this whole Turnover thing "good" policy, mind you). We really are giving you as specific information about the potential of the Turnover as we can. It is just something that has become vague and unfocused in-and-of itself.

When and if that ever changes, you guys will know. Until then, just pretend it never existed in the first place.

[Krillin]

You're not a newer member, Aqua. If there were a member clique, you'd be in it.