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+--- Thread: staff courtesy (/showthread.php?tid=9820)
staff courtesy - Sullivan - 12-03-2006
'K...I'm gonna lock this now, and if a higher-up disagrees, they can unlock it. But I think it accomplished it's goal, because opinions were given, and this is going nowhere anymore.
Retane's been unbanned, like Reb said. So, welcome back Retane!
^_^
Sorry guys, but I really don't want a huge argument to come out of this.
staff courtesy - Alura - 12-03-2006
Aw, I was hoping we might actually get a legitimate discussion out of this.
Oh well.
staff courtesy - Sullivan - 12-03-2006
Well, if you still think it can go somewhere...
I didn't mean to overstep bounds or anything, Reb. Just, I couldn't see it getting past where it had already gone.
staff courtesy - Alura - 12-03-2006
I trust your judgement
staff courtesy - Sullivan - 12-03-2006
Alright. Thanks Burt.
staff courtesy - Alura - 12-03-2006
Unlocking on request by Murasaki.
This is a CIVIL discussion. If anyone, staff and member alike, can't take critism then you should avoid posting. Also, anyone who is not open to listening to other views, and plans on being stubborn without trying to see the points made, can also be excused (again, both staff and members).
staff courtesy - Jewtastic - 12-03-2006
Thank you Burt.
Now please, I really want to try and get to some closure point, so lets try to stay civil in here...Thank you.
staff courtesy - Sol - 12-04-2006
I'm glad this was unblocked I wanted to thrown my opinions in and hopefully enage in a mature discussion and I was pretty disappointed when this topic was locked so I guess I'll throw my two cents in now.
-Was Retane right in posting what he did?
No not at all. No offense to him but what he did was simply unjustified and I can't defend his actions.
-Was Burter right to give Retane a warning/banning?
Yes, Retane not only broke the rules but did it in a disrespectful manor and (once again no offense to him) defiantly deserved some type of punishment.
So far that part is all cut and dry, but where it gets complicated was whether or not those staffers who replied after the ban were justified to say what they said. In my opinion no, don't get me wrong I totally agree with burter when he said:
Quote:Just because we are staff doesn't mean we have to sit and take abuse from people who are ungrateful, or impatient. I, for one, would never not defend myself if someone called me out in public, as I've demonstrated in the past.
Yes, staff have the right to defend themselves if they feel they are being disrespected, but my thoughts are that they(being vague to avoid naming specific staffers) overstepped their boundaries and took it beyond a point of self defense. Retane was wrong, he got punished, end of story. That's the way it should have gone, but instead certain people felt it necessary to input their unnecessary opinions which served only to purposely disrespect Retane in a manor in which he didn't deserve.
Staff members are supposed to be above such petty things and are supposed to set an example for the rest of the board to follow. I'm not complaining about any previous incidents, but in this specific instance some members of staff acted in a way that was very unbecoming of someone that is intended to be a role model.
Sorry if I rambled or said things that were already brought up but honestly I felt strongly about this and wanted my opinions to be heard.
staff courtesy - Banned Dana - 12-04-2006
Burter, no, I think that you were right in your posts. I just think that it's uncalled for to have others post after something has been settled. You said he was banned, called him out for what he did, and the issue was over. Then others began to post...which is what I believe isn't right.
staff courtesy - Sullivan - 12-04-2006
I can sypathize with you, Pan, but HF made a valid point in his.
=P
As far as Akane goes, you guys have to have some understanding for her. She's going through a really hard time now, and she can't really be called out for everything she does wrong...I know you guys think she made a mistake, and so did the others, but I doubt that anything similiar will be happening now.
So please, please, take it easy on her. Her dog died, and she's been having a tough time.
I'm not just coming in here saying 'Leave Akane alone!11!' and inserting a biased opinion...because I wasn't gonna participate in this at all. I just wanted to say that there was a reason she acted like she did, and with Retane calling all of staff out, I would've done the same thing if I was in a bad mood.
staff courtesy - OldNoriAccount - 12-04-2006
Because it just makes it worse. I just lounge around and feel sorry for myself, as well as thinking about things I don't want to think about.
I took a day off and well, it was the worst of my life. I came back and it improved, because I don't have time to think about things that make me cry if I am talking to people.
Thats not excuse though, even though Celipa stuck up for me.
This is off topic, although I posted this for Recoome's comment.
staff courtesy - Banned Dana - 12-04-2006
I'm not really bringing her up much for the fact that she's new and allowed to make these kinds of mistakes.
It's mainly the fact that this isn't the first time this has happened. What Reijin said was completely uncalled for and HF could have said his a bit better. HF's wasn't so bad, but and it's not really even what was said, it's just the fact that it carries on after it's over. It's pointless.
staff courtesy - Alura - 12-04-2006
Akane is still learning. That's the biggest excuse I can give her. The whole "my dog died" isn't an excuse to me, because if she was in a bad mood she shouldn't have posted.
However, as I just said, she's still learning. Akane is like the baby of staff, and it's noticable that with each passing day she's gradually learning what she can and can't do, like everyone does. She just has had to do it faster because of being staff.
staff courtesy - OldNoriAccount - 12-04-2006
Quote:Originally posted by Burter
Akane is like the baby of staff, and it's noticable that with each passing day she's gradually learning
Goo Goo?
But I will go with that. I'm learning what I can and can't do, and I'm getting better. Heck, when I was first made staff I didn't even know how to quote posts.
And look at me now, figuring out how Celipa closed the post.
Anyway. I admit to the fact that my dog might have had something to do with it, although like I said, as well as Burter, it isn't a excuse. I shouldn't have posted.
Does that mean I won't post in the future? I honestly don't know.
staff courtesy - Super Buu - 12-04-2006
Quote:Originally posted by BurterMaybe I'm bringing up the obvious here, or maybe I'm being completely clueless, but ... why would you put someone on staff if they're still learning? >_> I mean, she can learn, just still seems a little bizarre. Not a specific jab at you, Burter, just a pondering in general.
Akane is still learning. That's the biggest excuse I can give her. The whole "my dog died" isn't an excuse to me, because if she was in a bad mood she shouldn't have posted.
However, as I just said, she's still learning. Akane is like the baby of staff, and it's noticable that with each passing day she's gradually learning what she can and can't do, like everyone does. She just has had to do it faster because of being staff.
As for my opinion on the original topic, the only post that I really 'objected' to was Hellfighter's. The others after Burter's second post were neutral - not really bad, just not really contributive either. Like spam. Endearing, staff-based spam. >_> None of it really bothered me as such.
staff courtesy - Alura - 12-04-2006
She's only a story guide. That's the position we put people on who are still learning.
staff courtesy - Vejita I - 12-04-2006
I kind of felt the same way when I saw the thread. I saw the other staff posts and was like..."Huh". I'm not impatient nor am I ungrateful, but I just saw it as unneeded. You guys are correct that a staff member are undeserving of any flames, whether it was a mistake or not. They do their job without any reward. However, this is almost the same situation as if a member was cussed out, and he retaliated. He'd still be in just as much trouble as the original person that broke the rules. I understand you guys lose your temper. I don't know if I could have kept up with professionalism or not in that, but I still thought it was wrong.
And wow, I hope you guys aren't going to use this as a way to focus on Akane. She in my eyes made a mistake just as Reijin did, whose been here for like, day one. So yeah, that's ridiculous. I noticed this is turning from "Yeah, some staff made a mistake" to "Akane is still learning, so WTF did you put her on staff for?" Not a pot-shot, just thought that was unneeded, as well.
Anyways, I don't feel this is that big of a deal, but I felt like I should have thrown my opinion out there. I still don't BLAME you guys for being upset and saving what you did.
staff courtesy - Ashe - 12-04-2006
Akane and HF followed in my example as an Admin, so for their actions, I'll take the blame.
However, I really feel an overreaction is being made to my words. I did not, as Pan so nicely worded it, "hear about how Reijin wanted to say unkind things about Retane".
What I said was, "I'm glad Burter decided to take care of this, b/c I would have had all sorts of unkind responses to post.
EDIT: Oh jeez, am I seeing that "one minute time span" correctly? "
Where did I insinuate that I wished to make fun of Retane? I simply said that my reply would have been unkind, b/c I had had a bad day and it wasn't what I wanted to see. All I do was state that Burter handled it well, much better than I would have been able to at the moment, and commended him. I am sorry that doing so displeases you. Afterwards, I noticed that from what I could see it had been one minute time difference, and thus asked in order to clarify.
I apologize for being dense and stupid, but I'm missing where I was rude and flamed Retane here, as I'm being accused of.
staff courtesy - Alexander Trafford - 12-04-2006
Now i so didn't read this whole thread, so if i'm repeating, Burter simply slap me and tell me to go away.
My only problem with what happened in that thread is the same exact thing i've had a problem with the last two years. Sometimes it seems as though staff is above their own rules, and while it may or may not be true, i don't like it. I mean, don't spam the QSU and we have three staff members posting... basically repeating nothingness?
Set a good example for god's sake.
staff courtesy - Hellfighter 17 - 12-04-2006
I've been following this thread all day and I'll stand by my stance that my post isn't spam. It was hinted with anger and derogatory sarcasm, yes, but it had a merit to it.
I was not following anyone's example, Reijin, I was merely saying what I had to say, so no need to try to take the rap for me, although I feel there is no real rap from me to take. I saw the thread, left it for a while, came back and said what I had to say, so it wasn't a heat of the moment thing.